BETDAQ TRADER INTERVIEW: In the latest of our series of interviews with BETDAQ traders Stephen Maher catches up with full-time sport trader SEAN W to find out how he approaches trading on BETDAQ.
Stephen Maher: So first up, for you that doesn’t know you can you tell us a bit about yourself?
Sean W: Alright, I’m Sean W @young_devereaux on Twitter. I’m edging towards my testimonial year being in my early (ish?) thirties. I’m a full-time sports trader and have been since January 2007 specialising in cricket (in-play) and National Hunt horse racing. My first foray into full-time trading I guess came during my spell at Betfair, whom I started working for in 2005 on the Telbet desk. It was apparent after a few years of in-running punting via my bookies account and the like that the exchanges would then offer the right diversity.
This was a golden era, halcyon days if you like. API’s hadn’t really been fully implemented in the main stream, picture delays didn’t exist, well not in the eyes of most and one click betting was available to all bar a select few. Smartphones, Ipads and the like hadn’t even made the testing lab. That was a solid grounding, looking back there were a fantastic bunch of lads there (many of which I’m still friendly with) and life was so simple. It was of course the golden Summer of 2005 when the Ashes returned home and all shown on terrestrial television, channel four. I used to love been at my desk early to be greeted by Richie Benaud with the immortal ‘Morning Everyone’. I couldn’t wait to get to work everyday and didn’t want to leave, we had one click betting via the telbet system, SIS pictures (which you could win off in those days!) and lightning internet.
The exchanges were everything.. like most I could not believe the era we were in and I could do all of this from behind a PC. Clearly, it didn’t last for long as it gradually got harder and harder.
Stephen Maher: So, how did you first get into betting and racing?
Sean W: Like most I got into betting and national hunt racing through my Dad, who was a keen racegoer and punter, he probably started taking me racing in the early 90’s. He was national hunt through and through and I loved those big early jumping days at Chepstow in the autumn, which the BBC used to cover. I had an unhealthy obsession with Martin Pipe following a yard visit in 1995 as a nipper and his horses just seemed to always win. Other lads had posters of Gazza, I had one of Pipe and Scu.. Carvills Hill winning the Welsh National by a bus-ride. I was in awe of the fact that he just loved winning, I had the bug.
I was just old enough to bet legally (I think) and remember been at Chepstow for the big Welsh National meeting just after Christmas, I had worked a part-time job at a local hotel and had saved my Christmas money, watch out Chepstow I had a float! I was as usual in the on-course Tote credit betting shop (used to be for credit account holders only) but I always jibbed in. As always following and trying to earwig anything Pipey said on the blower, he loved that mobile phone. Bingo.. “Ours will win the bumper”. I will never forget the grade two bumper to finish the card, the horse was called Control Man and opened 11/4 I had 275/100 x 2 it returned 7/4 and in those wonderful jumping silks of the late David Johnson it duly obliged. What an outfit they were, did they miss? That was me hooked, easiest game in the World. Aren’t we all green as grass then.
It must of been around 2001 and I used to punt regular with bookmakers I remember studying their prices on teletext page 633 for hours, it really was a completely different ball game back then. I very occasionally won and mostly lost betting 5/6 either side on any sport that was live on Sky television checking the live prices on teletext 389 (I think?) as the in play prices would update in the corner. They used to send paper statements every month in the post.. how times change.
Stephen Maher: How many hours do you spend going through the cards/watching replays?
Sean W: I take my work very seriously and really love the research and study. Time doesn’t come into it. I adore what I do and most of the exchange betting is live sports in running. I have a fairly simple approach to the racing and it all starts from monitoring the five day entries and progresses from there really. I keep notes on the Racing Post website and these are fairly basic, such as gifted soft lead or wants further. Very basic but when written in the direct aftermath of a race can prove invaluable.
I print the following days cards around late afternoon and the pivotal part of any analysis and angle finding involves watching replays, usually just the horses last three runs, time consuming but something I enjoy and as a fearless West Country layer once told me years ago at Devon and Exeter.. “Let your eyes be the judge and your money the last thing you part with”. I will do a tissue on the races I am interested in but again this isn’t the art it once was with the markets going up so early. A healthier market for us all would involve these been abolished.. something that will never happen of course. The day of race is usually spent placing bets in the morning and finding any simple in running angles, usually overlooked until the last minute by most.
Stephen Maher: The exchange markets are fairly cagey in the morning, especially in Ireland. What would you do to improve liquidity before noon on Betdaq?
Sean W: The betting landscape has changed dramatically which has certainly had a huge impact on liquidity in the mornings. Price sensitive punters like myself really struggle and if there are no backers then there certainly won’t be any layers. It isn’t viable. 95% of racing markets have no strength up until the first show from the course. Mid 00’s it was possible to bet say 800 a industry priced horse of 7/2 at around 4.9 in the mornings but exchange liquidity in this sphere has seen a real decline since around 2008 I would say.
I initially used to not mind taking 5.8 the 5/1 shot but where is the sense in that? Does liquidity occur when punters believe they can beat the opening show from the course, I am not sure. The true exchange price only strengthens and stabilises in the last two minutes. Healthy morning liquidity would benefit traders and Betdaq alike. The bottom line is we need to bring the focus back and away from the obsession with the ‘late money’.
Stephen Maher: What was your biggest loss and how do you cope with losing runs mentally in general?
Sean W: Without doubt it was the cricket World Cup of 2011, it pains me thinking about it. I was over in India for the tournament working with an Indian syndicate. The entire nation had gone Sachin Tendulkar crazy with this been his swansong. India had looked average in the build up and during the early skirmishes. I was happy to tie a healthy proportion of my tank up laying them outright at around 4.5 and kept doing so as I won game to game, using the time delays to court side from the venues.
Finally, the semi final arrived against Pakistan, it was huge over there I remember it vividly. The game was in Mohali I was there working on behalf of the syndicate and in previous matches at the venue there was a huge toss bias with there had been serious dew affecting the bowlers late on, so batting 2nd was clearly the way to go. Fastest finger first I awaited the toss at the ground, bang Pakistan had won it and elected to obviously bowl. I laid 11k there and then. India from memory scored 260 odd, below par in my opinion there was serious dew gathering. The ball would be like a bar of soap. Pakistan had a shocker and never looked like getting there despite a late cameo from Misbah, it was all too late.
The moral of the story when your exit point is there always take your profit. I was still a bit green in those days and clearly didn’t pay as much attention to the figures as I should have. I have not been back to Chandigarh since and don’t intend to. Worse was to follow. I had most of my bank tied up on the outright and, as is the way, was mad keen to take them on in the final with Sri Lanka as well. I was very much whole duck or no dinner in those days. I again was at the Wankhede in Mumbai for the final on behalf of the syndicate. Again I got the toss right and laid the entire tank or what was left around about 7k or thereabouts. I also had the wages I was due from the syndicate on Sri Lanka been lunchtime favs – a popular bet in India, this again was a decent amount of US dollars, what they paid as I had worked on their behalf the entire tournament. Sri Lanka posted 274 odd from memory, not enough in the eyes of the punting mad nation as the rupees piled on the home nation, a foolish bet as I should of assumed they would of needed to go way past 290 to be lunchtime favs. Not to worry the pitch was wearing they had enough in my eyes, I would get the semi-final money back and draw on the outright. At 30/2 off 7 with the huge poles of Sehwag and Tendulkar in the shed I was feeling good.
The rest is history, India chased it down and won the World Cup. I had done the tank. I remember having a splitting headache as I stumbled into the taxi to take me to the airport straight after the match, the City was going bananas I could not wait to leave. I guess we all need to learn valuable lessons and nowadays I am far more conservative with my approach in terms of entry and exit points, everything is done by numbers now. No puntery strong opinions on outcomes only on phases of the match. Once you learn to stop making those bad trades/bets we are all guilty of, you know those lacking research and calculation then dealing with losing is part of the process as the figures show that overtime your in front. So it isn’t really a day to day thing or even month to month, really it is a bit more longer term. It is the ill researched trades and muggy bets that gripe me, losing is part of the process but you must lose at the right price.
Stephen Maher: If you could add one thing or make one change to the Betdaq site, what would it be and why?
Sean W: In running horse racing. A transparent and high tech product for all, across the board. I believe that like the most fluid markets on Betdaq, in running T20 cricket and tennis for example – that horse racing is really tailed off in this sphere nowadays due to the grey area of picture delays and the stigma attached. Those tennis and cricket markets are a joy, why? Because they move violently and react to every occurrence just like a horse race as it progresses, surely!? We know there are courtsiders at these events (I and I am sure many reading this have done their fair share) but we are all invariably watching the same pictures and most of the time are thankful of the courtsiders for filling our orders. We all know there are people at the venues for the tennis and cricket yet we are happy to bet, because for the most there is a feeling that we are all watching the same pictures. Some will obviously argue that you cannot afford this in a horse race, these time delays are crucial, nonsense.
If we all believe in the product and the pictures are transparent and fair across the board I feel this area could really explode again on Betdaq. Why are we so behind with horse racing? This is 2016. The firms don’t care and why should they when it accounts for such a tiny % of their turnover. We should be kicking on with live flash pictures, sectional times, horses speed all displayed on screen during the race and using the data to drive the product. Punters need to be able to access all this from home, if so this will take in running horse racing to the next level and if the punters believe in the fairness of the product then surely the liquidity will follow, no doubt.
Stephen Maher: How would you sell betting at XSP to someone who doesnt really understand it? It returned higher than industry SP in every Royal Ascot race bar one where it equalled – but it’s hard to get people away from old habits with bookmakers when there’s more value on the exchange in the lead up/at the off.
Sean W: I would advertise/market the figures. It is very difficult to advocate this to recreational punters, particularly when they believe that they have the BOG concession with their traditional bookmaker. Betdaq need to do more, much more to draw the recreational/casual punters back from the firms. You only have to look at the amount of advertising among competitors nowadays.
Stephen Maher: What would be, in your opinion, the best area to focus on for someone looking to get into betting more professionally?
Sean W: This is a difficult one to answer really. It goes without saying to focus on your strengths and eliminate your weaknesses. However, I would suggest in running horse racing and not in the sense of trying to click the winner by watching and committing during the back end of a race. Often, in most cases it can be relatively straight forward to lock in a profit during the course of a race by simply ascertaining that a horse is a front runner or has to lead, you will be surprised how effective this simple process can be. You are simply backing to lay, work out your entry and exit points prior and be realistic and start with very small stakes and record the results.
Similarly, reverse this process for a horse that would want to come off the pace and or need to be held up behind runners. This time you are obviously laying with the intention of backing as the race unfolds. Again a little research can go a long way and you don’t need to be an anorak to access the required information. Sounds remarkably basic but lots of people overlook the basics and or look for cleverer angles which may not exist. From experience most of the in running players from the course aren’t really interested in this angle they either want to commit late to find a winner, or lay anything that is coming under pressure. KISS (Keep It Simple Stupid).
Stephen Maher: Out of every jockey and trainer in Ireland and UK, who do you rate the most and why?
Sean W: Easy, Nicky Henderson! His love for his horses is often overlooked and he will never over train a youngster and will give them all the time they need. He is also mustard at getting them to concert pitch for the Cheltenham festival, just look at his record, it speaks for itself. What he achieved with Sprinter Sacre last season was barely believable. Prior to Sprinter’s comeback in the Shloer Chase at Cheltenham last November, I overheard Nicky Richards who was saddling Simply Ned describe Sprinter’s skin as sensational.. clearly many agreed as he was bet from 5/2 into 15/8 and literally watered the track as he announced to everyone that he was back! He is a great example of when a horse has the right owner and trainer combination.
A young jockey to follow is Harry Cobden, he looks very polished to me and been based with the Champion trainer Paul Nicholl’s is in the right hands to progress. A horse to follow (and I may be a tad biased) is CONAS TAIO he was placed brilliantly to win 7 (seven) handicaps last term and he’s not done improving yet. There are a few more projects like him and I am sure more winning days ahead with the new arrivals. www.allstarssportsracing.co.uk
Stephen Maher: I gotta ask! How was Euro 2016 as a Welsh fan? Any good gambling stories from their games?
Sean W: Incredible. Did it really happen? Firstly, we were all so happy to be there, just to witness Wales in a major Championship, something that money could never buy. So, we didn’t really have any expectations apart from sun and cold beverages. I planned the group games and to give it a right old lick, by the time I finally left I was very nearly fluent in French! First up, Slovakia in Bordeaux. I didn’t think we’d get beat, but wasn’t overly confident of victory but at around 2.02 DNB Wales, thought we looked a touch of value, several cleverer football judges than me confirmed this. So, I guess we hit the ground running. Next up the enemy in Lens, England opened around 1.56 but approaching kick-off they hit 1.7, the wrong price surely!? I had to do the unthinkable but as many will understand reading this of the same mould, it was one of them situations where you’d love not to draw. Anyway, we put in a spirited performance and we all left in high spirits, we had come so far. The sense of unity was really gripping among us all.
Onto the dot on the French card, Toulouse. Great place a ten-star nap, a must visit. Great people, sunshine, laid back and a great cafe vibe. I confess in having too much of a good time there. I maintained a suitable level of hydration throughout.. No view on the game and this is what I imagined summertime International Championships were all about. The sun shone all day, there was a sea of red on the banks of the River Garonne in the build up and a memorable evening ensued. The atmosphere was sensational, momentum was really building and we looked very handy in our three nil defeat of Russia. We were back on the bridle and this was now some journey, top of the group! On toParis we marched to play Northern Ireland, my waist band ever expanding and the float of euro’s somewhat diminished. A Carnival atmosphere for the entire day and buyers of the ‘Will Griggs On Fire’ renditions were never in any danger of not getting a max make-up! No view whatsoever here, purely elated to be there, after a tense game, we got through. Bloody’hell Wales in the quarter-finals of Euro 2016.
Next up The Belgians in Lille, now we really were on the crest, I always believe in the mantra back the man not the deal, and in this case the early 1.72 about Belgium was almost an insult, we were flying, our supporters buzzing and the team unity and camaraderie there for all to see. Ramsey looked to me like the best midfielder in the tournament, he was pulling all the strings and covering every blade of turf. This was on, maybe the heineken was now in my system but they were a serious lay over 90 minutes and so it proved as they went off nearer 1.99, always do your business at the right price as a clever man once told me. I or anybody else for that matter could not seriously envisage what pursued that night in Lille.. that Robson-Kanu turn mind, I still watch it before going to sleep at night. The dream double, it doesn’t get any better and without question that night will live long in the memory.
Diolch Wales. One of the greatest nights of all time and full credit to the Belgium supporters who were very dignified in defeat, sadly I can’t remember a lot from the final whistle to our semi final in Lyon – alittle bit of a drunken haze. Anyone ever been to Lyon? It’s a mental place, I have never seen so many coiffeurs shops. Coiffeur is French for barbers and they are open until 4am.. bizzare. Still a hot towel shave on the way back from the club to the hotel at 2am is almost full win bet material. In the end they were too good for us Portugal, especially without Ramsey and Davies but what a journey and something I will cherish forever.
Stephen Maher: Haha, that’s definitely the longest answer to a question we’ll get! Last question, see any major changes to the betting industry in the next year?
Sean W: It will be interesting to see what implications Brexit has on the industry. Initially, the fluctuating currencies have caused distress to one or two high profile owners who have cut back on their bloodstock. Nick Rust is probably batting above his average in his role as Chief Exec of the BHA. I do not like the fact that the Tote is bookmaker owned and we have missed endless opportunities there. Online continues to grow though and technology is advancing rapidly. Writing this has only shown to illustrate how much the landscape has changed during my innings thus far, not only do I feel quite old but it is incredible to think of all the changes and it is important to keep adapting and batting on! I do, though, truly love those 15 hour non-stop Saturdays with back-to-back sport!
Stephen Maher: Thanks Sean! You can follow Sean on Twitter @young_devereaux
£25 IN FREE BETS
